"Moroni's America" – The North American Setting for the Book of Mormon
The Book of Mormon in North America
"Moroni's America" – The North American Setting for the Book of Mormon
The Book of Mormon in North America
(And if you know anyone who hasn’t read Letter VII yet, share it with them ASAP.)
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Source: Letter VII
As we’ve discussed, M2C originated with Stebbins and Hills, two RLDS scholars. Their work was adopted by LDS intellectuals over the objection of LDS leaders.
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| Weston map |
In the late 1800s, the RLDS Committee on American Archaeology arranged for G.F. Weston to prepare six maps of Book of Mormon lands. The Committee reported that “Although the church never officially endorsed the maps, the proposed geographical locations of Book of Mormon cities and lands on the maps made a lasting impression which has been difficult to correct.”
To find this quotation, go to
https://stepbystep.alancminer.com/node/2268 and search for “lasting impression.”
You can see that this map Weston prepared depicts the land of Zarahemla in northern South America, basically Colombia and Ecuador, with Panama as the “narrow neck.”
Later, RLDS and LDS intellectuals decided that Panama was not the “narrow neck” and moved their geography into Mesoamerica.
Now, thanks to the work of employees at BYU, CES, and COB, most members of the Church have had Mesoamerica imprinted on their minds from a young age.
For example, right on its home page, BYU Studies still links to maps that show Cumorah in Mesoamerica, along with other Book of Mormon sites.
https://byustudies.byu.edu/charts/159-plausible-locations-final-battles
This map is a specific, intentional repudiation of the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah.
Such maps have “made a lasting impression which has been difficult to correct.”
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| BYU fantasy map |
As bad as the maps of Mesoamerica have been, the situation is getting worse all the time, now that CES and BYU both require students to learn the Book of Mormon using fantasy maps.
These fantasy maps portray the Book of Mormon itself as fiction. It’s not surprising that half of Millennial members of the Church don’t believe the Book of Mormon is an actual history.
Regarding these fantasy maps, we should reiterate what the committee said in 1898:
“Although the church never officially endorsed the maps, the proposed geographical locations of Book of Mormon cities and lands on the maps made a lasting impression which has been difficult to correct.”
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
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| Philadelphia temple at night |
Temples.
This web page has a nice temple counter:
https://www.listchallenges.com/lds-temples
In the last two weeks we visited 10 temples, some of them for the first time. That makes 87 total, just a little over half of the operating temples. We have visited temples in Central and South America, Europe, Asia, Africa, Australia/NZ, and North America.
(When we visited Antarctica there were no temples, only a small Chilean military base.)
It’s always inspiring to visit these temples and the missionaries and members who serve there. Last week we met a missionary from Mongolia. Almost everywhere we go, we meet people we know, who know us, or who are related one way or another.
The Latter-day Saints are awesome everywhere in the world.
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| Me at an awesome, undisclosed location |
Evidence. I’ve been doing a lot of traveling lately, partly to accumulate evidence about the Book of Mormon and Church history.
Sadly, thanks to M2C, many Church members (especially the youth) have been taught to reject the teachings of the prophets and instead rely on the teachings of intellectuals, based on what they deem to be “evidence.”
Once a person sets aside the teachings of the prophets, he/she is “tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine” (Eph. 4:14). This is the situation in the Church today regarding Book of Mormon historicity.
Church members don’t know what to think because they have rejected the teachings of the prophets, often without even realizing it.
While I think members of the Church ought to exercise faith and simply accept the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah, especially when the prophets have consistently, persistently, and uniformly taught the same thing, people cannot believe in something they have never been taught.
Paul expressed it this way: “how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?” (Romans 10:14).
We have reached the tipping point on this topic because most members of the Church today do not even know what the prophets have taught.
Decades of traveling around the world meeting members of the Church of all ages on every continent have shown me a sharp distinction between two groups of members.
1. Most members who know what the prophets have taught accept the New York Cumorah.
2. Most members who accept M2C don’t know what the prophets have taught.
The exceptions, of course, are the intellectuals (and their followers) who know what the prophets have taught but reject those teachings.
Those who study on their own, or who were educated before the 1980s, usually fall into category 1. This group is aging, of course, so there are fewer and fewer members in this category.
Because M2C is currently being taught by CES, BYU, Visitors Centers, and Church media, while the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah are completely censored, young and new members of the Church fall into category 2.
The youth in the Church today are being trained to rely not on the teachings of the prophets, but instead on the opinions of intellectuals, based (as they claim) on evidence.
Fortunately, the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah are fully corroborated by evidence, so even by the standards of the M2C intellectuals, those teachings will ultimately prevail.
It’s just a shame that, in the meantime, so many members of the Church are being deprived of the teachings of the prophets.
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Source: Book of Mormon Wars
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| Baptism of John |
The readings for last week’s Come Follow Me lesson included Luke 20, although that chapter was not actually cited in the lesson materials.
Luke 20:1-18 relates the parable of Cumorah.
Here is the text in blue, along with my comments in red.
1 And it came to pass, that on one of those days, as he taught the people in the temple, and preached the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes came upon him with the elders,
These are the M2C intellectuals confronting all the prophets who have taught that Cumorah is in New York.
2 And spake unto him, saying, Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things? or who is he that gave thee this authority?
The M2C intellectuals teach their followers that President Oliver Cowdery and all the other prophets and apostles had no authority to teach the New York Cumorah.
3 And he answered and said unto them, I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:
Those Church members who still believe the prophets ask the M2C intellectuals this same question.
4 The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?
The New York Cumorah, was it from heaven, or of men?
5 And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?
The M2C intellectuals reason among themselves, saying “If we shall say the prophets are inspired, Church members will ask, why don’t you believe them?”
6 But and if we say, Of men; all the people will stone us: for they be persuaded that John was a prophet.
The M2C intellectuals think, “If we say those prophets who taught the New York Cumorah were speaking as men, Church members will reject us because they believe the prophets.”
7 And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was.
Our M2C intellectuals answer by saying, “we cannot say where the teaching of Cumorah came from.”
But today’s M2C intellectuals are more clever than the scribes of old. They avoid answering the question about the prophets with two techniques:
1. They censor the teachings of the prophets (e.g., the Saints book), but when members discover those teachings on their own, they resort to their second tactic.
2. They confuse members of the Church by mixing up two separate teachings; i.e., the prophets have taught that (i) Cumorah is in New York and (ii) we don’t know the locations of other events. The M2C intellectuals quote the second teaching and claim it applies to the first.
8 And Jesus said unto them, Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things.
After observing how intellectuals in the Church have repudiated the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah, current Church leaders have left it to each member of the Church to decide for ourselves whether to believe the prophets or the intellectuals.
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I won’t take the time to go through verses 9-18, but as you read them, think of the parable of the tenants (vineyard) in the context of the New York Cumorah.
The Lord sent his prophets to teach the New York Cumorah, starting with Moroni teaching Joseph Smith, President Oliver Cowdery teaching the Church, and all the subsequent prophets and apostles reaffirming these teachings.
Intellectuals in the Church have cast out these prophets, one after the other.
Their followers likewise cast out the prophets, preferring the wisdom of men as taught by CES and BYU.
Those members of the Church who still believe the prophets can be confident that soon enough, “the stone which the builders rejected, the same will become the head of the corner.”
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
On a personal level, I like everyone I’ve met who participates in the M2C citation cartel.
Most of the Church members I know who still believe the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah feel the same way about the people in the M2C citation cartel. We stipulate that everyone involved with the cartel is faithful, devoted, educated, intelligent, loving, wonderful, etc.
If we didn’t love them, we wouldn’t care enough to offer constructive criticism. None of our criticisms are personal in nature.
We appreciate much, maybe most, of what they do. I’ll put the figure of 90% on it. IOW, we like 90% of the material they publish.
I think that, if not for M2C (Mesomania), I’d like 98% of what they do. (There remain lingering problems from revisionist Church history, most of which are attributable to M2C.)
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For example, here are some of the truly great things Book of Mormon Central provides. I’m grateful to have them available, and I recommend these resources all the time.
1. The Royal Skousen material on the earliest manuscripts of the Book of Mormon.
2. Bookofmormononline.net.
3. Some of the material in the archives.
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The problem is, M2C taints almost everything the citation cartel produces.
FairMormon has a lot of good material, but M2C is woven throughout.
The Interpreter and BYU Studies have some good articles, but anything touching on Church history and/or Book of Mormon is edited to promote, or at least accommodate, M2C.
For those of us who still believe the teachings of the prophets, we can’t recommend that our friends (aka investigators) or less active members seek answers from Book of Mormon Central, FairMormon, the Interpreter, BYU Studies, etc., because M2C undermines their faith.
These resources actively teach that the prophets are wrong about the New York Cumorah and other issues. Teaching aids such as the CES and BYU fantasy maps depict the Book of Mormon as fictional.
Sending people to the M2C citation cartel is akin to sending them to CES Letter, except that CES Letter is more open about its opposition to the teachings of the prophets.
We think the M2C citation cartel is worse, actually, because the M2C advocates claim the support of the prophets and the Church for their teachings–even when they say the prophets are wrong.
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This is not to say that we expect the M2C citation cartel to suddenly accept the teachings of the prophets.
Instead, all we ask is that they cease their monolithic opposition to the teachings of the prophets.
The situation would be different if the M2C citation cartel (including employees at BYU, CES and COB) followed the Church’s position on neutrality.
That’s what we do on this blog. We frequently refer readers directly to the M2C citation cartel so they can see for themselves what is being taught.
We want our readers to make informed decisions and trust them to do so.
We don’t care what people decide. We just want them to make informed decisions.
That’s not the case with the M2C citation cartel.
M2C depends on censorship and sophistry to undermine faith in the teachings of the prophets.
If the cartel trusted their readers, listeners, and viewers to make informed decisions, cartel members would not insist on M2C exclusively. They would present, or allow others to present, the information that corroborates and supports the prophets, instead of censoring that information.
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We think the psychology of bias confirmation is too strong to allow members of the M2C citation cartel to change their minds, or even to inform their readers and followers of alternative perspectives.
Plus, the M2C citation cartel has a tremendous investment in M2C, including professional, financial, and psychological investments.
IOW, even though sunk costs are sunk and should not be considered going forward, we don’t think the situation is going to change.
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Soon, we will announce an alternative to the M2C citation cartel that people can refer to without the M2C barriers to faith.
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
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western New York
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southern Mexico (M2C)
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Joseph Smith (President of the Church)
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H. A. Stebbins (RLDS scholar)
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Oliver Cowdery (President of the Church)
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L. E. Hills (RLDS scholar)
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David Whitmer (3 Witnesses)
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David A. Palmer (LDS author)
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Brigham Young (President of the Church)
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John Sorenson (BYU professor)
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Heber C. Kimball (First Presidency)
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John W. (Jack) Welch (BYU professor)
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Wilford Woodruff (President of the Church)
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Dan Peterson (BYU professor)
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Parley P. Pratt (Quorum of the Twelve)
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Kirk Magleby (LDS author)
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Orson Pratt (Quorum of the Twelve)
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Brant Gardner (LDS author)
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Joseph F. Smith (President of the Church)
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Noel Reynolds (BYU professor)
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Joseph Fielding Smith (President of the Church)
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Shirley Heater (CofC author)
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Anthony W. Ivins (First Presidency)
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Jerry Ainsworth (LDS author)
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James E. Talmage (Quorum of the Twelve)
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Joseph Allen (LDS author)
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LeGrand Richards (Quorum of the Twelve)
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Garth Norman (LDS author)
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Marion G. Romney (First Presidency)
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Louis C. Midgley (BYU professor)
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Mark E. Petersen (Quorum of the Twelve)
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John L. Lund (LDS author)
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Ezra Taft Benson, Gordon B. Hinckley, Thomas S. Monson (Presidents of the Church)
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Tyler Griffin (BYU professor), Matt Roper (LDS author) and others affiliated with Book of Mormon Central
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And there is no overlap between these two groups. They are as distinct as it gets.
However, they know as well as everyone else that the teachings about Cumorah in each column of the table are specific and clear. These are facts easily found and verified.
The most common rationalization among those in the Mexico column is that the people in the New York column were merely stating their opinions as men.
Everyone is welcome to accept that interpretation.
Of course, that interpretation would apply to anything the prophets teach that one wants to reject.
Some of those in the Mexico column have persuaded themselves that the New York Cumorah is inconsistent with a Mesoamerican setting for most of the events in the Book of Mormon, which they take as a given.
But we all see the logical fallacy there.
The Mesoamerican setting is a mere assumption, based on a subjective interpretation of the text designed to fit the assumption. It’s pure circular reasoning.
And, everyone is welcome to accept logical fallacies, including circular reasoning.
But at the same time, everyone is welcome to accept the teachings of the prophets.
No one is bound by the teachings of the intellectuals, except those who don’t know what the prophets have taught.
Which students at CES and BYU never learn.
But they can learn it here:
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
I found the following comment interesting because some time ago, I asked Book of Mormon Central why they don’t invite me to speak at their conferences. (They host a mediocre conference with a handful of M2C proponents and just a couple of hundred attendees. If you ever get a chance to attend, you ought to just to see it for yourselves.)
The answer I got: “We don’t agree with you.”
That’s precisely the approach taken by leftists on college campuses everywhere.
This occurred about the time when Book of Mormon Central censored my Letter VII book from their archive.
Here’s how the President of Bard College explained the problem of the doctrinaire approach, which is the approach taken by the M2C citation cartel.
What does distress Mr. Botstein is the absolutism of the doctrinaire. The doctrine Bard subscribes to, he says, “is the power of reason, the power of argument, the power of language, the power of critical inquiry, and the willingness to try stuff out, and to revise one’s point of view. It would be horrifying to think that I think exactly the same thing that I thought 20 years ago, or that one doesn’t consistently learn.”
One of the fundamental principles of M2C is that they already have the answers and they don’t want to learn new things that corroborate the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah.
Botstein also said this:
This last statement, unfortunately, is partly a mistake. It’s actually much easier to teach when there is no ability to have ideas scrutinized and criticized. Employees at BYU, CES, and COB, especially participants in the M2C citation cartel, know this. They depend on it.
At BYU, they teach M2C exclusively by teaching students that the prophet are wrong about the New York Cumorah. They handle potential scrutiny and criticism by simply censoring alternative views, especially including the teachings of the prophets.
BTW, when people ask me what I think of BYU, I explain that if they still believe the scriptures (including the Bible) and the prophets, they should probably not send their children to BYU. I think it’s far more damaging to faith to be taught that the prophets are wrong at a university sponsored by the Church than to be taught that at a secular university.
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
Because the M2C citation cartel insists the “real” Cumorah is in Mexico, not New York, they consistently reject every historical account about the New York Cumorah. They also reject all the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah.
As we’ve seen, it’s not only the M2C citation cartel but also the revisionist Church historians who are changing Church history to accommodate M2C, such as the Saints book.
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| BMC logo that incorporates Mayan language to explicitly reject the New York Cumorah |
In this case, we have another M2C no-wise from Book of Mormon Central about the sword of Laban.
The article points out that the sword of Laban was made of steel, a point that critics claimed was impossible. However, a steel sword has been found near Jericho that dates to about 620 B.C., which corroborates the account in the Book of Mormon.
This could be important evidence of the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
Actually, it is important evidence of the historicity of the Book of Mormon for those who still believe the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah.
But because of M2C, Book of Mormon Central frames the sword of Laban as a purely visionary item!
IOW, they want people to believe that because the “real” Cumorah is in Mexico, David Whitmer and Oliver Cowdery must have seen the sword only “in vision.”
As usual, Book of Mormon hands a gift to critics such as the CES Letter.
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Here is the link to the no-wise.
https://knowhy.bookofmormoncentral.org/content/what-was-the-sword-of-laban-like
I’ve discussed some of the sword of Laban issues before, here:
http://bookofmormonwars.blogspot.com/2017/11/visiting-temple-square-moroni-at-hill.html
Let’s look at a portion of the no-wise. Original in blue, my comments in red.
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
The entire article is worth reading (the link is below).
For example, the article describes the operation of citation cartels, such as the M2C citation cartel of Book of Mormon Central, FairMormon, BYU Studies, the Interpreter, etc.
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
“I do not think that all who choose wrong roads perish; but their rescue consists in being put back on the right road. A sum can be put right: but only by going back til you find the error and working it afresh from that point, never by simply going on.”
#CSLewis
For decades now, LDS intellectuals have been traveling down the road of the M2C hoax. Continuing along that road will lead only to further confusion and doubt.
The solution is to go back until we find the error; i.e., return to the origins of M2C among RLDS intellectuals who invented the two-Cumorahs theory in opposition to Joseph F. Smith and the other LDS prophets who reaffirmed the New York Cumorah.
These RLDS scholars rejected Letter VII and the teachings of the LDS prophets. Some LDS scholars in the early 1900s embraced the RLDS position over the objection of the LDS prophets. In the ensuing decades, through the academic cycle, these M2C intellectuals have persuaded generations of LDS members that the prophets were wrong about the New York Cumorah.
If, as Lewis suggests, we go back to this error and “work it afresh,” we will see that:
1. The prophets have consistently and persistently taught that Cumorah is in New York.
2. We don’t know for sure where other events in the Book of Mormon took place.
We can be sure that if people continue to repudiate the teachings of the prophets, and continue to conflate these two distinct teachings, confusion and doubt will continue to plague the Latter-day Saints–just as President Joseph Fielding Smith warned long ago.
But if we go back to the error and work it afresh, we will see that there is abundant physical and scientific evidence that supports the teachings of the prophets about the New York Cumorah. Confusion and doubt will evaporate.
Source: Book of Mormon Wars
