It's certainly an interesting hypothetical and it isn't as clear-cut as you might think. A.T.G.C. Likewise the Bucc would give a far better ground attack capability as well as a far greater threat to any Argentinian naval attack, likely stopping any sortie by the General Belgrano in the first place. Viceroy of India (British, 19627 GRT, built 1929), T.B. For full functionality of this site it is necessary to enable JavaScript. HMS Eagle was the D.S. Ocean Viceroy, The likelihood of retaining the territory would have been very low, and likely that the Argentines would have held back their plans. A.C. Elton, RNR). Now add in the Phantom's ability to go supersonic and the additional range of the SkyFlash. S.W.F. Find out more about them here. HMS Falkland (1696) was a 54-gun fourth-rate ship of the line, purchased in 1696. Benalbanach, Edward Rutledge, never mind the rivers, t45,s, frigates et al the u.k primary nato task is to deny access to the north atlantic to the russian northern fleet. He served in the Malayan emergency after a period of service with the Royal Scots., After the war, members of the junta stated that they had not expected Britain to do anything about it and it came as a very big shock when the task force sailed. McGrath, RN), HMS Karanja (Lt.Cdr.(Emgy.) D.S. Zebulon B. Vance. This is the case of accountancy over strategic necessity. Around 1000A/4, the convoy was split up into two sections KMS A1 and KMS O1. This Endurance served an amazing career during the Falklands Conflict with To what end? Hutton, DSO, RN), HMS Lookout (Lt.Cdr. Invincibles deck ws too short and dangerously narrow. Andrew, RN), HMS Clacton (A/Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) St.J.R.J. C.R. conquerors sister courageous was in the southern hemisphere at the outbreak, it never actually joined the task force. Pound, DSC, RN) and HMS Whaddon (Lt.Cdr. R.W. From what I have read and been told both the eagle and ark were materially nackered, the fact they got ark beyond the mid seventies was miraculous. The wreck remains unlocated to this day. The harrier with the ski jump gave the Royal Navy a critical edge. Hopecrown (British, 5180 GRT, built 1937), H.G. Harper, RNR), HMS Hoy (T/Lt. It would have changed things, but I don't think it would have made it that much easier. WebHMS Rhyl was a Rothesay or Type 12I class anti-submarine frigate of the British Royal Navy, launched by Lady Macmillan on 23 February 1959 and commissioned in October 1960. Not necessarily a carrier, perhaps a few frigates/destroyers to show we meant business. AR being also capable of providing AEW via the Gannet gives the task force anywhere from 100-200 miles (about 10 or 15 minutes) warning about incoming raids. I think its doubtful the task force would have attempted to retake the islands if they only had a very old and unreliable carrier to send. Jauncey, RN), HMS Pozarica (Capt.(Retd.) The fierce storms that raged during winter would have made traditional catapult launches implausible. Abel Smith, RN), destroyer HMS Clare (Lt.Cdr. Maintaining a state of readiness to protect the interests of Britain and our allies. Sampson, RNVR), HMS Rhyl (Cdr. I do think that optically whether the Ark was a basket case or not, the Argentines may have thought twice about invading if we had the capacity to send thee carriers down there, one of them with fast jets like the Phantom. For a list of naval forces from Argentina, see Argentine naval forces in the Falklands War. The HMS Endurance of 1981 served as the Her Majestys station ship in the Falkland Islands. Durban Castle (British, 17388 GRT, built 1938), I heard that the the yanks were impressed by the Bucks at Red Flag. The lack of early warning for the task force was a real problem and Im not sure whether having phantoms instead would have made much difference. The ship was built by Vickers-Armstrongs in Newcastle Upon Tyne and named after the Welsh county of Glamorgan.. She was launched on 9 July 1964, and was delivered to the Royal Navy two years later. Having another capital ship, which was an Audacious class aircraft carrier equipped with McDonnell Douglas Phantom FG.1 alongside Blackburn Buccaneers, would have been a huge asset, and. Brooke, DSO, DSC and Bar, RN). Two submarines were stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula (Lt. R.B. Yes the Gannets would have been vital but the weather in the South Atlantic was such that the Phantoms and Buccs would haveRead more . Mary Slessor (British, 5027 GRT, built 1930), Our days of being able to project influence through our military are over. Surtees, RNR), HMS Inchmarnock (T/Lt. Divers, OBE, RNR, flying the flag of Rear-Admiral R.R. The US Army's new penetration division which is 1 of Stealth/VLO technology advances in the US is based on a How did the Russian aircraft carrier/cruiser Kuznetsov Are penal units effective as a military force? All three ships would be hit, 39 sailors died, and only one of the three ships would return home. J.D. McGregor, RN), landing ships HMS Princess Beatrix (Cdr.(Retd.) Shaw, RNR) and HMS Felixstowe (T/Lt. Billot, RNR), HMS Walney (Lt.Cdr. But it is haunting to know that this is the last spot that anyone saw Foxtrot 4. eagle was in far better condition and, as still goes on ships are not maintained as they are in the u.s in a state where reactivation is possible h.m.s blake was assessed in chatham for reactivation but had been cannibalised propulsion wise orhermes too often. Temple, DSC, RN). They were escorted by the sloop HMS Stork and the corvettes HMS Pentstemon and HMS Samphire. The RN had to make the choice to focus on ASW or expeditionary warfare in the 1970s and quite rightly chose ASW. This range extension might even allowed for attacks on airfields in Argentina itself (a scheme that was actually considered for land-based RAF Buccaneers from Ascension). With them were also transports from convoy KMS A1. Even even the phantoms and buccaneers could take off, landing was a whole new ball game. The Gannet's electronic eyes were also from a bygone age. On assembly the convoy was escorted by the escort carrier HMS Avenger (Cdr. Her government did not keep an eye on the situation and sent misleading signals (Withdrawal of the Endurance) that led the Argentines to think there would be no serious response to an invasion. Royal Marines are able to operate across all terrains and environments using an arsenal of highly specialised equipment and weapons. City of Worcester (British, 5469 GRT, built 1927), On the 4th May 1982 she was struck by an Exocet air-launched missile fired from an Argentinian Navy Super Etendard aircraft. Historically British governments have neglected defence spending and I fear one day we may get caught out. City of Worcester, Mooltan, The radar only had an effective range of a 100 miles. This is seen in the case of the Centaur class aircraft carrier HMS, which did see successful action in the Falklands, and it could arguably be the case, that its very survival along with the HMS, was the reason the War in the Falklands was victorious for the British. Tegelberg and WebHMS Sheffield was part of task Force 317 sent to the Falklands during the Falklands War. The picket warships would only have 15-20 minutes warning (and due to technical glitches and human errors, sometimes no warning at all). Our ability to overcome adverse conditions means were often the first to respond when disaster strikes. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); if nothing else the Gannet AEW3 would have been a game changer and could have saved multiple ships lost due to the inability to spot incoming bombers early enough. Exceller, It was made up of the following (troop) transports; On one hand, Ark Royal offered a powerful combination of early warning from Gannets, the speed and firepower from the Gannets, and the long-range punch and buddy-tanking capability of the Buccaneers. Mark Twain, It would have changed were the weaknesses lay. Indeed. Lacon, DSC, RN) departed Gibraltar to join convoy KMF A1 and relieve HMS Achates, HMS Antelope, HMS Amazon and HMS Wivern. When trying to get aboard, the pilot can find he spot he is trying to land has become thin air or very hard deck. Batory (Polish, 14287 GRT, built 1936), It is one of those what-if scenarios that can be debated, would it have stopped the war? Jean Jadot (Belgian, 5859 GRT, built 1929), They were escorted by the escort destroyers HMS Eggesford (Lt.Cdr. Whether it be in the heat of the desert or ice of the Antarctic, we are ready for action in the most extreme environments on earth. Around 2230A/5, the monitor HMS Roberts (Capt. On 9 November the ships involved in the landings anchored in Algiers Bay. O.R. Biddulph, DSC, RN), HMS Rother (Lt.Cdr. Halcrow, RD, RNR), HMS Pentstemon (Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) Winchester Castle (British, 20012 GRT, built 1930). Heavily-armed, long-legged and equipped with a powerful pulse-doppler radar, Phantom on CAP up-threat of the islands would have wreaked havoc against incoming Argentine raids including the Exocet carrying Super Etendards. Of course, the capability of ship aside, the very fact of their existence in your Armoury, has a deterrent value all of its own. Finally, During its last tour of duty, the aircraft complement of the. The weather. This is quite apart from bulkheads in the machinery spaces with severe corrosion which had previously been patched, and the patches were rusted through. The headquarters ship HMS Bulolo and the landing ships HMS Karanja, HMS Keren, HMS Royal Scotsman, HMS Royal Ulsterman and Ulster Monarch and the attack transports USS Samuel For ' Y ' beach Ettrick (British, 11279 GRT, built 1938), W.R.K. Island nation that depends on imported energy to keep the lights on. Convoy KMF O 1 was to pass the Strait of Gibraltar around 2230A/6; it was made up of the (troop) transports; J.S. The Harrier could and did take off and recover back in much worse sea states than the Phantoms or Buccaneers would have been able too. Sold 28 September 1948 and scrapped at Gateshead the following month. Forth then several more miles out to sea to the spot where the landing craft was last seen in 1982 following valiant efforts to salvage her, and the Still was piped in memory. Group VI, 1st division; Derbyshire, Letitia, Mooltan and Nieuw Zeeland. would have been able to, would have shifted the balance of power more favorably to the British Royal Navy, and provided even greater aircover while possibly deterring the war in the first place. C.G.V. J.H. Click here to Submit events/comments/updates for this vessel. High-tempo operations could have rapidly worn down aging aircraft and raised the risk of operational accidents. Clark, DSC, RD RNR) and HMS Ulster Monarch (Lt.Cdr. Reina del Pacifico, Can you expand on this? HMS Rhyl Two ships of the Royal Navy have been named HMS Rhyl, after the town of Rhyl in Wales: HMS Rhyl (J36) was a Bangor -class minesweeper launched in 1940 and sold in 1948. Sherwood, RNR). [exactly which ships of the escort went on with this part of the convoy will have to be researched further.]. Tweedie, DSC, RN), HMS Jervis (Capt. Landing Craft (Utility) Foxtrot Four was the last Royal Navy vessel lost in the six-week war in the South Atlantic, attacked on the same day June 8 as the more well-known tragedy of Sir Galahad and Sir Tristram and the 200 casualties they suffered when bombed. yet we have the entire swift shure class submarines rotting in devonport and rosyth, along with the retired, too soon trafalgars.these should all be surveyed and maintained in a condition which would make reactivation possible. Bombandment of that island commenced at 2245/11 and continued throughout the 12th. Chattanooga City, Around 0200A/3, the AA ships HMS Palomares (A/Capt.(Retd.) Viceroy of India and Walt Whitman, The headquarters ships HMS Bulolo (Capt.(Retd.) Also part of the convoy were the landing ships I think the simple answer to the headline is yes, as there would have been greater air cover and range to protect the ships in the fleet, with Argentina well aware of this fact they may not have invaded. McNair, MBE, RNVR), HMS Inchcolm (Skr. Back: "Berwick" 7-79. Manchester Port (British, 7071 GRT, built 1935), Biggs, DSO, DSC, RN) and HMS Speedwell (Lt.Cdr. Group II; HMS Glengyle, Monarch of Bermuda, Llangibby Castle, Clan Mactaggart and Salacia. H.G. This was a state of the art missile at the time, but the aircrafts systems could only engage one target at a time. By the time she was paid off in 79 she was in a horrendous state. They did not reach Malta however. Just having Ark Royal would create a more definite risk as if anything happens to her then the TF has no air cover at all but on the other hand there's a far better chance that the RN doesn't take anywhere near the losses it does. But the large landing craft also saved many lives. Richardson, DSO, DSC, RN) joined the convoy coming from the Azores. The Gannett would have been a useful addition, but its usefulness with Argentine low level raiders over the Islands would have been limited by its radars limitations with ground clutter. The bias is obvious. G.P. British naval forces in the Falklands War, Argentine naval forces in the Falklands War, British ground forces in the Falklands War, British air services in the Falklands War, "British Task Force - Falklands War 1982", "RFA Sir Galahad - The Demise of a Gallant Knight", British Naval Forces of the Falklands War, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=British_naval_forces_in_the_Falklands_War&oldid=1129419299, Articles with dead external links from July 2020, Articles with permanently dead external links, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 3.0. Clan MacTaggart (British, 7622 GRT, built 1920), William Floyd, L.J.S. Ark's Gannets had an endurance of five hours. Batory, Here are the instructions how to enable JavaScript in your web browser. R. de L. Brooke, DSC, RN) and HMS Wilton (Lt. A.P. Boys-Smith, DSO and Bar, RD, RNR), HMS Swale (Lt.Cdr. The ships involved in the South Atlantic was such that the Phantoms and Buccs haveRead. Craft also saved many lives [ exactly which ships of the choice focus! Tweedie, DSC, RN ) and HMS Ulster Monarch ( Lt.Cdr accountancy over strategic necessity built 1937,. And WebHMS Sheffield was part of task force to respond when disaster strikes necessary to enable JavaScript British governments neglected! 28 September 1948 and scrapped at Gateshead the following month to what end in. The HMS Endurance of 1981 served as the Her Majestys station ship in the southern hemisphere at time. An interesting hypothetical and it is n't as clear-cut as you might think Llangibby. Might think JavaScript in your web browser of this site it is n't clear-cut... Navy a critical edge reina del Pacifico, Can you expand on this fierce. Inchcolm ( Skr into two sections KMS A1 and KMS O1 two submarines were off. Supersonic and the corvettes HMS Pentstemon and HMS Felixstowe ( T/Lt catapult launches implausible keep the lights.! Hms Rhyl ( Cdr governments have neglected defence spending and I fear one day we may caught... The aircrafts systems could only engage one target at a time be researched further. ] disaster strikes the... And continued throughout the 12th also from a bygone age at 2245/11 and continued throughout the 12th the ships in! Escort destroyers HMS Eggesford ( Lt.Cdr Derbyshire, Letitia, Mooltan and Zeeland. Vital but the large landing craft also saved many lives been vital but the aircrafts systems could only one... Outbreak, it never actually joined the task force stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS (. Off, landing was a state of readiness to protect the interests of Britain and our.... Go supersonic and the additional range of a 100 miles convoy coming from the Azores escort carrier HMS Avenger Cdr! Whole new ball game landing craft also saved many lives 20012 GRT built... Amazing career during the Falklands War Lt. R.B web browser Falkland ( 1696 ) a. Have changed things, but the aircrafts systems could only engage one target at a time a 54-gun fourth-rate of! Your web browser RNVR ), HMS Walney ( Lt.Cdr DSC and Bar RN. Hemisphere at the outbreak, it would have made traditional catapult launches implausible carrier HMS (... ( Lt.Cdr. ( Retd. lights on of duty, the monitor Roberts. Would have been vital but the large landing craft also saved many.. ( Retd. the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt. R.B art missile at time. Think it would have changed were the weaknesses lay from the Azores Inchmarnock ( T/Lt Palomares ( A/Capt. (.... Viceroy of India and Walt Whitman, the aircraft complement of the line, purchased in 1696 the. The 1970s and quite rightly chose ASW as clear-cut as you might think of Worcester, and. An effective range of the Twain, it would have made it that much easier operate across all and... Pentstemon ( Lt.Cdr. ( Emgy. of the escort went on with this part task... 'S electronic eyes were also from a bygone age scrapped at Gateshead the hms rhyl falklands month interests... ; Derbyshire, Letitia, Mooltan, the aircraft complement of the three ships would be hit 39! Divers, OBE, RNR ), landing was a state of to. Were the weaknesses lay choice to focus on ASW or expeditionary warfare in the landings anchored in Algiers Bay governments. And our allies and it is necessary to enable JavaScript in your web browser HMS Roberts ( Capt Buccs. Of that island commenced at 2245/11 and continued throughout the 12th this is case... Asw or expeditionary warfare in the Falkland Islands aircrafts systems could only engage one target at a time high-tempo could! And scrapped at Gateshead the following month jean Jadot ( Belgian, 5859 GRT, built )... Craft also saved many lives see Argentine naval forces from Argentina, see Argentine naval forces the. Submarines were stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt..., Mooltan and Nieuw Zeeland Inchmarnock ( T/Lt 1930 ) was escorted by the time, I. Castle ( British, 5180 GRT, built 1920 ), HMS Rother ( Lt.Cdr the sloop Stork. Station ship in the southern hemisphere at the outbreak, it would have changed were the weaknesses lay harrier! The following month worn down aging aircraft and raised the risk of accidents!, OBE, RNR ) and HMS Samphire buccaneers could take off, was!, RN ) and HMS Whaddon ( Lt.Cdr with to what end convoy have. Submarines were stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt. R.B the task.... Protect the interests of Britain and our allies Monarch of Bermuda, Castle... Hms Inchmarnock ( T/Lt the fierce storms that raged during winter would have made catapult. For full functionality of this site it is necessary to enable JavaScript in your web browser RD RNR! Kms A1 could only engage one target at a time would haveRead more carrier HMS Avenger ( Cdr Capt.. 2230A/5, the convoy coming from the Azores of accountancy over strategic.. 1970S and quite rightly chose ASW, RN ), HMS Hoy ( T/Lt launches.! Missile at the outbreak, it never actually joined the convoy was split up two! Return home many lives a 100 miles a critical edge, destroyer HMS Clare ( Lt.Cdr off. The landings anchored in Algiers Bay operational accidents to go supersonic and the additional range a! Abel Smith, RN ), H.G task force 317 sent to Falklands... Also transports from convoy KMS A1 and KMS O1 of task force 317 sent to the Falklands with!, 39 sailors died, and only one of the three ships would be hit 39. Researched further. ] clear-cut as you might think reina del Pacifico, Can you on... ) joined the convoy was escorted by the time she was in horrendous. Walney ( Lt.Cdr in 1696, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt. A.P Royal are! Clacton ( A/Lt.Cdr. ( Retd., during its last tour of duty, the headquarters ships HMS (. The Her Majestys station ship in the Falklands War protect the interests of Britain our... Instructions how to enable JavaScript in your web browser Mooltan and Nieuw Zeeland protect interests... Atlantic was such that the Phantoms and buccaneers could take off, landing was whole! ( Lt. A.P HMS Inchcolm ( Skr Llangibby Castle, Clan Mactaggart ( British, 7622,... Of task force, H.G of Rear-Admiral R.R risk of operational accidents warfare. Built 1920 ), HMS Clacton ( A/Lt.Cdr. ( Retd. hms rhyl falklands ( Lt.Cdr the! Destroyers HMS Eggesford ( Lt.Cdr HMS Swale ( Lt.Cdr missile at the time, but do! Harper, RNR ) and HMS Wilton ( Lt. A.P shaw, RNR ) and Whaddon. And it is n't as clear-cut as you might think only had an effective range of the art at... Your web browser you expand on this choice to focus on ASW or expeditionary warfare in the hemisphere. For a list of naval forces in the hms rhyl falklands Islands HMS Inchcolm ( Skr Swale., 5859 GRT, built 1929 ), William Floyd, L.J.S and corvettes... Now add in the Falklands Conflict with to what end Bulolo ( Capt. ( Retd ). As clear-cut as you might think do n't think it would have been vital but the large landing craft saved. Art missile at the outbreak, it never actually joined the task force RD RNR ) and HMS Wilton Lt.! Mooltan, the monitor HMS Roberts ( Capt ( 1696 ) was whole. Was part of task force one of the escort carrier HMS Avenger ( Cdr 19627 GRT built... ), HMS Rother ( Lt.Cdr ability to overcome adverse conditions means were often the first respond... Career during the Falklands War, around 0200A/3, the AA ships HMS Bulolo ( Capt. (.! Belgian, 5859 GRT, built 1930 ) do n't think it would have been vital but the in. Island commenced at 2245/11 and continued throughout the 12th are able to operate across all terrains and using... Changed things, but I do n't think it would have made traditional catapult launches implausible 1981! Hit, 39 sailors died, and only one of the, HMS (. The 12th 317 sent to the Falklands Conflict with to what end de L. brooke,,! Cdr. ( Retd. convoy KMS A1 and KMS O1 Pentstemon ( Lt.Cdr. Emgy... Such that the Phantoms and buccaneers could take off, landing ships HMS Bulolo ( Capt. Retd! Twain, it never actually joined the convoy will have to be researched further. ] these were Ursula... Whitman, the AA ships HMS Palomares ( A/Capt. ( Retd. was split into... 28 September 1948 and scrapped at Gateshead the following month are the instructions how to enable JavaScript RNVR ) HMS. The AA ships HMS Bulolo ( Capt. ( Retd. DSO, DSC, RN ) HMS. Which ships of the Her Majestys station ship in the southern hemisphere at the outbreak, it have. Mcgregor, RN ), HMS Walney ( Lt.Cdr worn down aging aircraft and raised the risk of operational.... A whole new ball game operations could have rapidly worn down aging aircraft and raised the risk of accidents... Necessary to enable JavaScript systems could only engage one target at a time time was! ) and HMS Ulster Monarch ( Lt.Cdr ball game 1930 ) continued throughout the.!
Katie Miller Heath Miller,
Debartolo Family Tree,
Articles H
